Working with David Bowie on Blackstar, St. Vincent, and Developing His Sound -- A Go Encore Revisit
Go Encore: This is a revisit of one of Go With Elmo's most celebrated early conversations. The original episode with Mark Guiliana is a perennial favorite -- re-released here for listeners who are discovering the show for the first time and for longtime fans who know it deserves another listen.
Mark Guiliana is one of the most original drummers working in any genre -- a musician who built his sound at the intersection of jazz improvisation and electronic music production, and whose career has taken him from the New York jazz underground to the studio where David Bowie made his final record. When Bowie's team called, it was because they needed someone who could hold a groove that felt both ancient and futuristic, human and electronic simultaneously. Mark was the only person who could do that.
In this conversation -- one of Go With Elmo's most requested revisits -- Elmo and Mark go deep on what the Blackstar sessions were actually like, what Bowie asked of him musically and personally, and how the full weight of those recordings became clear only after Bowie's death just days after the album's release. They also cover Mark's work with St. Vincent, his own deeply individual approach to developing a sound, the influence of electronic music on his drumming, and what he believes about the relationship between practice and artistic identity. This is one of the most honest conversations in the show's history.
"He didn't want someone to play like a drummer. He wanted someone who understood sound the way he understood sound. That was the whole conversation."
The full story of the Blackstar sessions: how Mark got the call, what Bowie was looking for, the specific musical direction of those recordings, and what it was like to be in the room with one of the most singular creative forces in rock history as he made what turned out to be his final artistic statement.
How Mark processed the album's meaning after Bowie's death -- the experience of understanding in retrospect what was being made, how he thinks about the music now knowing what it was, and what he believes Bowie understood about his own situation that shaped every choice on that record.
Mark's creative relationship with St. Vincent: what drew them together musically, how the collaboration expanded what both of them were doing individually, and what working with Annie Clark taught him about the way the best musical partnerships challenge each person to operate outside of their comfort zone.
The specific artistic decisions that produced Mark Guiliana's completely individual approach to the drum kit: the electronic influences that shaped how he hears rhythm, the years of practice that went into building a sound that sounds like no one else, and his philosophy about what it means for a musician to have a genuine voice rather than just a high level of technical ability.
How Mark built a musical identity that drew from both jazz tradition and electronic production in ways that didn't feel like a compromise of either -- the specific influences, the artists who pointed the way, and why he believes the most interesting music of the next generation will come from people who refuse the genre boundaries that everyone else accepts.
Mark's approach to the practice room and what he believes about the relationship between sustained, directed practice and the development of a genuinely individual artistic voice -- why he thinks most musicians practice too much of the wrong things, and what the musicians he admires most were actually doing when they became who they are.
Mark on the Blackstar sessions in full: what Bowie actually said to him about the music, the specific sounds they were going for, the moment during the recording when he realized he was witnessing something rare, and how he experiences listening back to that record now knowing everything that came after it.
On receiving the call from Bowie's team: what it felt like, the preparation he did before the sessions, and the specific thing that Bowie said in the room early on that told Mark everything he needed to know about what kind of drummer this project required and why he had been chosen for it.
His theory of sound development: the specific argument Mark makes for why most musicians don't develop individual voices despite years of effort, what the ones who do have in common, and the discipline he applied to his own practice that he believes was directly responsible for making him sound like himself and no one else.
On the influence of electronic music on acoustic drumming: the specific producers and records that changed how he hears rhythm, what he was trying to translate from the machine world to the acoustic world, and why he believes the drummers who engage seriously with electronic music are the ones who will define what the instrument sounds like in the next 20 years.
The St. Vincent collaboration: what Annie Clark pushed him toward musically that he wouldn't have found on his own, what her approach to the studio and to composition challenged in his own practice, and why he considers that partnership one of the more important creative relationships in his career.
His advice for musicians trying to develop an individual sound: concrete, specific, and honest -- including what he would tell a younger version of himself to stop doing, the single change in his practice approach that made the biggest difference, and why he believes the goal of "sounding like yourself" is harder than most musicians understand until they're deep into trying to achieve it.